341 replies to this topic

[Seb.F]

Did it work before you went in? Yes Did it work after you came out? No Quite obvious what happened.

[mbes2]

http://www.consumera...e-my-car-(again!)-Wont-admit-fault-and-want-ME-to-pay-more-to-fix!! sounds/looks same? first ever time I took my VXT for a service, vauxhall dealer (vx220 trained) broke my expansion bottle, then said it was like that when I brought it in.... Or speak with http://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/ on where you stand? VX'er stand together goodluck buddy, happy to help if I can

[Pidgeon]

'Seb.F', on 19 Sept 2011 - 10:44 AM, said:

Did it work before you went in?

Yes

Did it work after you came out?

No



Quite obvious what happened.

Not quite so simple. If they tightened the plug to manufacturer's settings and the head failed, it is not their fault. My understanding is that the head only fails when overtightened? OP may need to prove this.

[Andrew aka Stuwy]

'Partridge', on 19 Sept 2011 - 11:55 AM, said:

'Seb.F', on 19 Sept 2011 - 10:44 AM, said:

Did it work before you went in?

Yes

Did it work after you came out?

No



Quite obvious what happened.

Not quite so simple. If they tightened the plug to manufacturer's settings and the head failed, it is not their fault. My understanding is that the head only fails when overtightened? OP may need to prove this.

car is booked into AmD tomorrow for a report. then i will have an independant report on whats wrong and what caused it, its going to cost me £30/60 (which noted is more or less the cost if i serviced the car myself)

armed with that information i can move forwards. 1 of 2 things will happen, they will say yes it was GSS fault and i can move forwards with that.. or they will say we just think it happened all by it self and i'll have to swallow the cost and repair it myself...

[Mike (Cliffie)]

If they do end up paying, I have a head you can have for £500, if you end up having to fix it, the going rate for a used head is about £150... Good luck Stu, it will not be a pretty battle and you are currently car-less.

[Seb.F]

The head shouldn't just crack on its own no.

[Andrew aka Stuwy]

just found this http://www.speedster.../tis/index.html ;Documentation section: Engine and Engine Aggregates (the last one on the list) on page 8 it states the Nm to be 40 for spark plugs is this correct? and is there anyway of testing the streangth of how tight then are in atm? thanks cliff, i'll bare that in mind

Edited by Stuwy, 19 September 2011 - 12:21 PM.

[slindborg]

'Stuwy', on 19 Sept 2011 - 12:18 PM, said:

just found this

http://www.speedster.../tis/index.html

;Documentation section: Engine and Engine Aggregates (the last one on the list)


on page 8 it states the Nm to be 40 for spark plugs is this correct? and is there anyway of testing the streangth of how tight then are in atm?

thanks cliff, i'll bare that in mind

There are slightly specialer (yes thats a word) torque wrenches that have a bi-directional gauge on them to see how much torque is needed to undo things.... problem is friction etc will now play a huge part and make the undoing reading fairly high.

40NM sounds MASSIVELY over the top imho.


This is the very reason I'll do anything on a VX bar spark plugs

[Andrew aka Stuwy]

'slindborg', on 19 Sept 2011 - 12:30 PM, said:

'Stuwy', on 19 Sept 2011 - 12:18 PM, said:

just found this

http://www.speedster.../tis/index.html

;Documentation section: Engine and Engine Aggregates (the last one on the list)


on page 8 it states the Nm to be 40 for spark plugs is this correct? and is there anyway of testing the streangth of how tight then are in atm?

thanks cliff, i'll bare that in mind

There are slightly specialer (yes thats a word) torque wrenches that have a bi-directional gauge on them to see how much torque is needed to undo things.... problem is friction etc will now play a huge part and make the undoing reading fairly high.

40NM sounds MASSIVELY over the top imho.


This is the very reason I'll do anything on a VX bar spark plugs

sorry i ment 20nm

[Andrew aka Stuwy]

update..

they wont budge, he said that cylinder 4 is week and its a design fault and even removing the old plugs could have caused the damage, its not their fault he said, it not your fault he said.. "we are not in the blame game"..

the torque wrench certificate will be in the post as will the data that they used to torque the sparks up.. and that means if its wrong it will be doctored..

Edited by Stuwy, 19 September 2011 - 05:24 PM.

[The Batman]

book it in with vocky! get a nsecond hand good head, new timing chain etc least you will know that the engine will be very safe now that it has a new gm timing chain on it. also get him to show you how to service your car!!

[Andrew aka Stuwy]

"its an inherent problem with these cars and you just have to accept it" p.s Joe the likely hood of me getting anything out of this garage is remote so it might come to that.. in the mean time i have no car. Christmas might be cancelled...

[Bargi]

'Stuwy', on 19 Sept 2011 - 5:24 PM, said:

"even removing the old plugs could have caused the damage"

OK it could have, but they didn't notice it when they removed the plug.
They also didn't notice the damage after putting the plug in.

It's not clear cut what's happened but it's in their care and they're "professionals"
I reckon the best ending could be both parties paying half the repair costs?

It's not ideal but could be an alternative?

[Hark]

'Stuwy', on 19 Sept 2011 - 5:36 PM, said:

"its an inherent problem with these cars and you just have to accept it"



p.s Joe the likely hood of me getting anything out of this garage is remote so it might come to that.. in the mean time i have no car. Christmas might be cancelled...

Small claims court?

Solicitors letter isn't expensive.

I find it hard to swallow that they, as a competent garage, can fit spark plugs and crack the head and then argue it's a design fault.

[Big Steve]

Write them a letter clearly stating your complaint, and informing them that you intend to obtain an independent engineers report. State where you intend to get that done. Keep copies of letters, make notes of discussions.


Give them a clear time by which you want them to respond.


Get the engineer's report and a quote for reparation.


Send copies of all of this, requesting recompense.


If they won't play ball, there is a small claims process that you can follow.


This lot will guide you on following the correct process.

www.consumerdirect.gov.uk/contact


Go for it Stuwy. With any luck it won't come to this; most companies back down when they get the letter and see that you are serious.

[2.2_na]

'Big Steve ', on 19 Sept 2011 - 6:12 PM, said:

This lot will guide you on following the correct process.

www.consumerdirect.gov.uk/contact


Go for it Stuwy. With any luck it won't come to this; most companies back down when they get the letter and see that you are serious.

If your car was ok before the work was done, THEY did the work, and now it's not ok, then it has to be down to whatever THEY did - whether they admit they are liable or not.

[J4EY D]

I cant believe they're response, they sound like they couldn't give a crap. Im happy to go to the garage with you as a bit of support, not in a confrontational way as thats not going to solve anything... even if it is what they deserve. Keep me up to date buddy, let me know if you need a hug

[turbobob]

Have they told you what torque they tightened it to? It's a bunch of BS they are feeding you. If the head was cracked before they put the spark plug in, then they should have informed you. Make sure the calibration certificate references 'UKAS' on it thumbsu . Check who they are accredited by. And check the date on it too. In fact put a scanned copy up on here when you get it. Put all parts to the cert up. There are a few things I would like to check.

[vocky]

it's not going to be a cheap repair either, parts will be around £500 and then the garage labour costs will more than double that figure as the clam needs to come off to swap the head. head gasket £45 head bolts £20 genuine timing chain kit £175 engine coolant £20 another head £150 - £250 which will most likely need stripping down to inspect for problems and to fit new valve stem seals valve stem seals £25 And all because someone over-tightened a spark plug

Edited by vocky, 19 September 2011 - 07:35 PM.

[ArticMonkey]

IMO a great excuse to go supercharged then.

Edited by ArticMonkey, 19 September 2011 - 07:37 PM.