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Scotland Independence


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#241 LY_Scott

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Posted 27 November 2013 - 03:55 PM

 

Tories have never had any say in Scotland. There's the running joke that there's more Giant Pandas in Scotland then Tory MP's.

 

It's the anal prolapse of Labour that thrust the SNP to a majority that and the Lib Dems.

 

http://en.wikipedia...._election,_2011

 

 

ahh but the 'mean old tories' are running the show from London.... If the useless reds were in charge there I would wager the indie lark wouldnt have been wheeled out.

 

 

Well, it's certainly a convenient motivation but the reason it's on the table is that the SNP have a majority from 2011. They won the election in 2007 over Labour as well but without a majority so couldn't get a referendum bill through the parliament and cross party committees. There was talk at that time of a referendum 2010 but they couldnt manage.

 

The collapse of Labour in Scotland and across across the UK since 2008/09 and the Lib Dems getting into bed with the Tories has given them the majority they needed to get the referendum bill through. They would be doing it regardless of who was in London though.

 

 



#242 LY_Scott

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Posted 27 November 2013 - 04:04 PM

 

SNP aren't as often presented a one trick pony party. You have to look at Tuition fees, prescriptions, care for the elderly, their focus on renewables as demonstrated in a thread I created today etc.

They're clearly not a one trick pony. They need to have had some popular policies (for both pre and post referendum) and some bribes to the conveniently extended electorate otherwise they'd have never been able to form a viable government to even push the referendum. Golf resorts aside, anyway. 

 

But, when their central tenet is full independence for Scotland (even if you would then cede control of your currency to a different country's central bank and half your other powers to Brussels :lol: ) anything less than that result is a rather large fail on their part and most definitely on the leaderships part. To then, all of a sudden, decide that devomax is palatable after all and that they can work within that framework is somewhat of a volte-face and must surely make Salmond/Sturgeon/whoever's positions untenable, if the SNP is to carry on in it's current guise.

 

Assuming a "No" vote and that the SNP survives as a majority government, do you as a country go through this pain again every 2-3-4-5 years until they get the result they want, even if it's just a 50%+1 vote of those who turn out, which might by then only be 30% of the electorate through fatigue? Or do you just say fcuk it, stick that one on the back burner for another 20 years and get on with making the best of what we've got (which is already more than anybody else in the UK)?

 

I thought (probably incorrectly) that the SNP was formed out of an amalgamation of smaller democratic/liberal/socialist parties over the years. But, Scottish politics is very far from any expertise or real interest I have (and why I've no idea about Scottish Labour and how sh!t they may or may not be in comparison to the muppets down here).

 

I hope you stay. But if you go, I'll happily wave goodbye to the newly unemployed Westminster MP's that independence will create.

 

 

I think the slide towards devomax (and they wanted it as an option in the referendum but pulled it out to get agreement with Westminster to hold it at all) is that it's more palatible for the electorate. I think it's something they'd aim to go to as a stepping stone to the ultimate goal rather than stopping there. A gradual transfer of control.

 

What happens after a No vote? Who knows. It's not without it's own risks. We've stuck our necks out now and there's already voices piping up to remove powers. It'll be a case of we'll see.

 

I think the SNP with dust themselves down and look to present it again in a few years. But if we vote No and they put it forward to quickly they'll find themselves out of power for quite a while and Jo Lamont's Scottish Labour as our only alternative at the moment, god help us.

 



#243 Rosssco

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Posted 28 November 2013 - 09:59 AM

What the SNP will do subject to the impending NO vote, is use the vote to target any future problems in Scotland with an "if we'd only voted for independance" line to put the blame back onto the people of Scotland...



#244 Tony H

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Posted 28 November 2013 - 11:09 AM

Not been following the news much lately but will any of this effect the availability of irn-bru, wham bars and highland toffee? Would it be financially astute to get a pallet in to hedge against future uncertainty?



#245 LY_Scott

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Posted 28 November 2013 - 11:15 AM

Pretty sure the highland toffee place on larbert is already shutdown lol

#246 Gedi

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Posted 28 November 2013 - 11:16 AM

Highland Toffee and Wham bars are made in Blackpool now, so that's one less thing to worry about. 

 

I don't really drink Iron Brew, so I'm all for having the Scots leave the UK



#247 G-Bob

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Posted 28 November 2013 - 11:22 AM

I don't really drink Iron Brew, so I'm all for having the Scots leave the UK

 

Me neither... I drink IrnBru though.  ;)



#248 LY_Scott

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Posted 28 November 2013 - 11:29 AM

Tizer, Rockstar, Orangina, Rubicon...

#249 Gedi

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Posted 28 November 2013 - 11:37 AM

 

I don't really drink Iron Brew, so I'm all for having the Scots leave the UK

 

Me neither... I drink IrnBru though.   ;)

 

 

 

What happened to the 'O'?

Maybe it decided to leave because it thought it could do better on its own?



#250 G-Bob

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Posted 28 November 2013 - 11:46 AM

Always been spent like that... the stuff with the O is the cheap supermarket knockoff stuff.

 

You'll miss out on the square sausage and potato scones as well.  Nom  :wub:

 



#251 LY_Scott

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Posted 28 November 2013 - 01:01 PM

Got to love IRNBRU's marketing style. This is their take on the coca-cola name on the bottle shite

#252 LY_Scott

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Posted 28 November 2013 - 01:02 PM

Posted Image

#253 techieboy

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Posted 28 November 2013 - 01:12 PM

:lol: thumbsup

#254 Mike (Cliffie)

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Posted 28 November 2013 - 01:27 PM

Knock down Haydrians Wall, dig a trench and push em out to sea. Lets face, the Scotts can't play cricket so what use are they to us?

 

Hang on, would I need an International B Race Licence to go to Knockhill?


Edited by Mike (Cliffie), 28 November 2013 - 01:28 PM.


#255 G-Bob

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Posted 28 November 2013 - 01:50 PM

 

Hang on, would I need an International B Race Licence to go to Knockhill?

 

Yes.... and a stab-proof vest.



#256 Gedi

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Posted 28 November 2013 - 02:13 PM

Knock down Haydrians Wall, dig a trench and push em out to sea. Lets face, the Scotts can't play cricket so what use are they to us?

 

 

Love this idea! You'd need to dig along the border though, otherwise we'd lose half of Northumberland



#257 slindborg

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Posted 28 November 2013 - 02:19 PM

 

Knock down Haydrians Wall, dig a trench and push em out to sea. Lets face, the Scotts can't play cricket so what use are they to us?

 

 

Love this idea! You'd need to dig along the border though, otherwise we'd lose half of Northumberland

 

 

thats not a bad thing



#258 LY_Scott

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Posted 28 November 2013 - 09:10 PM

Question Time tonight should be good. Also watch this. Im not usually a Sturgeon fan but in this one on one debate, she's full of win.

#259 Mangham54

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Posted 28 November 2013 - 09:38 PM

Question Time tonight should be good. Also watch this. Im not usually a Sturgeon fan but in this one on one debate, she's full of win.

Sorry Scott, but please retract that last comment. As accurate as your point may be? The use of "full of win" is not something that should be said aloud.

#260 techieboy

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Posted 28 November 2013 - 11:19 PM

Fcuk me this LibDem (nice work on the part of the Conservatives in palming off the poison chalice) Minister for Scotland is a bit wet but he's well outnumbered on the panel.




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