443 replies to this topic

[Exmantaa]

Good luck trying a stand alone in a tuv controlled country... peter is very cautious about what freedom and tables he gives his users, but as said it is continuous improving...

[slindborg]

why is he cautious? is it because hes not sure what all his tables do yet or hasnt actually implemented them or simply tyring to cover his ass incase someone grenades an engine and then tries to sue?

Is he TUV approved, or is it the blag that its a simple remap, honest...

 

is he actually coding the system, or a semi hack of the OEM code and his to make something a little more tweakable?

 

These are only questions to understand more, not to take cheap shots btw.

[fezzasus]

given that he first required people to visit him for the remap, and only recently started offering it by post, i would say his caution is over covering his ass.

 

Doubt he's TUV approved, however to the inspector it's an OEM ECU, which it is...

 

Change from 8 bit to 16 bit fuel table suggested hes coding rather than hacking.

[slindborg]

With stand alone you could leave the OEM ECU in place and hide the new one

[Rosssco]

With stand alone you could leave the OEM ECU in place and hide the new one

 

Think others tried something similar during the war - ze Germans would spot it..

 

OBDT may not have all (or near) the flexibility of a proper, fully calibratible (word? Should be..) ECU, but then it lets us relative noobs play tuner and feel technical driving about with a laptop on the passenger seat, clicking things, whilst not grenading the engine..

 

And of course it does a appreciably better job than previous Norfolk-based efforts in terms of drivablity..

[alexb]

Going back to the subject of IAT. from what I understand:

- air temperatures can spike, but under bypass open condition with little air flowing into the engine. Opening the throttle, cooler air enters the engine and air temperature after the SC actually goes down

- at constant rpm, the SC pumps a constant mass of air. Lowering the temperature after the SC doesn't increase the air mass. So no power gains are to be expected by lowering the air temperature after the SC and the reverse is also true, no significant loss of power due to high air temperature, if you're just looking at air mass

- temperature of the air after the SC has to be lowered to avoid detonation

 

So what's causing the power loss that people experience on track? From what I read it can be the 57C IAT safeguard, but that's an on/off and not a gradual thing. Is it that the ECU retards ignition more and more based on higher air temperatures? Or does the ECU retard ignition based on the amount of knock it senses. Or is it both?

[Exmantaa]

why is he cautious? is it because hes not sure what all his tables do yet or hasnt actually implemented them or simply tyring to cover his ass incase someone grenades an engine and then tries to sue? Is he TUV approved, or is it the blag that its a simple remap, honest...   is he actually coding the system, or a semi hack of the OEM code and his to make something a little more tweakable?   These are only questions to understand more, not to take cheap shots btw.

he is just very cautious that ignorent people blow up their engine with his software. (f.i. He tests out new injectors first before adding them to the user interface.. this is discussed several times, but his solution makes the ecu tweakable, while keeping the oem functionality, including all fault finding stuff for the dealers. Works for 90% of the users... But by all means fit a stand alone if you think you neef one.

Edited by Exmantaa, 23 June 2014 - 12:51 PM.

[Exmantaa]

@Alex; ignition retard to avoid detonation...

[slindborg]

So he is limiting his product because of stupid people thats a shame.

[CHILL Gone DUTCH]

Protecting what he has achieved, By stupid people doing things which would risk there engine,

[slindborg]

When you buy a stanley knife to trim some stuff, do you expect it to come with rubber blades because someone once cut themselves?....

 

 

[smiley]

The 90% stupid buying the product are very happy customers.

The 10% that do not buy it seem to have many many issues with either the price, the functionality, the creator or a combination.

  

[slindborg]

hmm, yes I clearly hate this peter person...

[alexb]

@Alex; ignition retard to avoid detonation...

 

whatdoyoumean? That I'm retarded?

[Exmantaa]

@Alex; ignition retard to avoid detonation...

  whatdoyoumean? That I'm retarded?

Maybe... How are your IAT's lately??

[Scuffers]

The 90% stupid buying the product are very happy customers.

The 10% that do not buy it seem to have many many issues with either the price, the functionality, the creator or a combination.

  

that's a very patronising argument.. and wholly wrong.

 

my beef with it is that as it stands, IMHO its not a tuning tool, it's a glorified map loader.

 

For example, how can you set the advance table on a dyno when you cannot turn off (or at least see) the effects of the knock control? 

 

same goes for fueling, without being able to turn off closed loop, how can you adjust the map and know where you are? (I would also argue that you cannot do self-fuel learning without a decent wideband, trying to make fuel changes based on a narrow band sensor that are inherently not calibrated is a joke).

 

to then use the argument it's safer like that is just bogus, it's not going to stop somebody putting bad numbers in the map is it?

 

this is the same arguments that Hondata had to deal with some 10 years ago when they first started out with software to map the OEM Honda ECU, their problem was they started by only knowing some 20% of the stuff in there, these days I recon they are up to maybe 75%, so you still have to understand that parts you have no access to.

 

to use this as an argument for or against stand-alone s also bogus, obviously, if you had full access to the OEM ECU there would be little point in an aftermarket solution (unless you want features that the std one cannot support), the issue is you need to have proper software.

 

My question is this, just how much of the std ECU has he actually got into and 100% understand?

[smiley]

 

My question is this, just how much of the std ECU has he actually got into and 100% understand?

 

 

He got into it at least 1% deeper then DBilas (original creator of the SC map), klasen and CS.

Could be more.

 

But all kidding aside, it does not matter how deep he goes.

The product is better then what we had for the last 8 years.

Without it, we would still be stuck with stage II. (especially everyone outside the UK)

 

And of course stand alone with full control is the holy grail.

It's just not for everyone.

Edited by smiley, 23 June 2014 - 03:22 PM.

[Scuffers]

sorry, I just don't follow that logic, maybe because I come from a somewhat different perspective.

 

your suggesting that a 99% bodge solution is better than a 100% bodged solution?

 

Look, I am not trying to sell you a stand alone, what I am trying to get you to see is the limitations of it, and some of these can be somewhat disastrous.

 

I think it's great somebody is looking to develop something like this, what scares me is what I see so far is nothing like enough to use to map an engine safely/correctly.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[vocky]

The 90% stupid buying the product are very happy customers.

The 10% that do not buy it seem to have many many issues with either the price, the functionality, the creator or a combination.

  

If I still had a z22se ECU I would rather have Peters map on my car than either an adjusted OEM map or a poxy standalone ecu mapped by some idiot*

 

What Peter created was what the z22se ECU needed, nobody else outside GM has done better 

 

 

 

*that is not aimed at anyone in particular, just the reality of bitter experience 

Edited by vocky, 23 June 2014 - 03:41 PM.

[CHILL Gone DUTCH]

Until you know what peter is doing you shouldn't really comment on the software, It might not be what your used to But there's no denying it's working