46 replies to this topic

[Duncan VXR]

I must go out in a s/c or turbo'd honda lump at some point! I was looking at the 3.0 tfsi v6 S/C lump to put in to be different and for soundtrack over 4 pot options prob more hassle than it's worth mind 5 pot tfsi rs lump 100% easy fit and go well on software Vx220 just makes more sense as a base car but then I know them really well so no suprises Max stop showing me links to stuff I cant afford and want lol DG

[vxproject]

Hi Everybody

 

Great advice, appreciated as always.

 

My reasons for jumping straight over the 300 mark, I had the stage 2 for the whole day, felt quick in 1st gear, however 2nd 3rd 4th 5th were fast don't get me wrong timed at early 4s was a lot of fun, not Shocking  fast, totally agreed wouldn't even drive a high power car to its limits until I got to know every gear, my last car it wasn't until I was a year in to driving it, could  I say I can push this car to its limits without losing it (in the dry).

 

The tsfi sound great, but seems labour heavy until someone has enough experience to get the job done fairly quickly , me thinking might be better I stick with the z20let forged engine for a direct swap, if there's such a thing, lack of experience talking.

 

Sent GMS  a pm for info on there engine, does it look like a decent spec? looking through other forged engines this ones a unusual spec with a massive turbo, this turbos probably not suited to the vx,   GMS  seem very reputable in the tuning scene confidence is high.

 

Well my story.... had a lot of high power cars in my early years, not had a single toy for the last 8 years usual story mid life crisis at 40, also the vx is the closest thing I can find to a atom/go-kart that can be used as a daily drive,Im confident in saying this is without a doubt my forever car so that it will need a lot of power to keep me surprised and have 16k to pump into a car give or take.

 

Thumbs Up!

 

[Captain Vimes]

16k total or Base car + 16k? If it's the former then I'd forget trying to get 400+bhp.

[Cookies220]

There's a substantial jump in performance from a 'stage 2' to a 'stage 4'.  I'd recommend having a go in a stage 4 before deciding you definitely need 400 ponies.  Plus, the driveability (is that a word) does become diminished the more power you get.  Don't get me wrong, it's perfectly usable all year round, but even with my modest 296bhp, just a dab of throttle in damp or wet conditions will spin the rears up in 1st 2nd and 3rd so you need your wits about you (or TC).  I know you've said you don't mind Tubby or SC, but do you just want BHP figures or do you want torque as well?  If you want both, I'd go with a Tubby. 

 

You'll need to remember that you always get used to the power eventually so you may find yourself in a situation where you've built a £16k engine but in a year or so you'll want even more power   I think you'd be better off starting with the Audi lump as it would be easier to get to where you want to be, and then beyond if you want - Duncan VXR's your man for that!

 

Good luck whichever path you choose - get a build thread going when you finally take the plunge 

[mbes2]

400bhp+ daily drive vx220 ?? speak to Nev.

[manus]

400bhp+ daily drive vx220 .

There are no issues on drive-ability if you mount a decent Traction Control system. Next to the engine power increase, consider Wider wheels and tires Gearbox cooler or different box LSD Chargecooler, extra oil cooler Rev counter that will go beyond 6700 TC Bigger brakes, Abs upgrade Earplugs All sorts of bits and pieces to reduce weight And so on.....

[Dunk]

*cough*

[jonnyboy]

These big power projects are all very technically impressive but why? I have had all manor of different tuned/standard Lotus/VX and the best one of them all? 122BHP K series Elise. Or a standard 2.2 NA. 

 

I just bought a Honda S2 (NA)  but I'm still not 100% sure I will part with my K series car for it. Had a Rotrex S2 Elise recently that was pretty good but too fast for road use with 285BHP. Power is good for the first handful of times you drive it but then you just get used to it but ultimately you are left with a potentially unreliable car that you just spunked 20 grand on....

[Rosssco]

If you are seriously considering pumping a 5-figure sum into an engine, you should also consider the latest generation of Ecotec Turbo engines Gen II / III Ecotec), essentially the latest versions of the VX220's 2.2 Z22SE engine. http://en.wikipedia....M_Ecotec_engine   As used in the current Astra VXR, and the Insignia SRi (plus lots of US cars, hence many tuning parts) its an almost drop in because its the same basic engine as the 2.2, so engine mounts, gearbox, clutch, driveshafts, coolant pipes are all connect up.   You'd need all the stuff as a stage 4 turbo (chargecooler, exhaust, larger turbo, fuelling, engine management), but after that its just generally better in everyway compared to a generation older turbo engine, plus its lighter and more fuel efficient too.. The standard engine is good for ~400bhp according to many US users.   Unique LNF features[11] include: a twin-scroll turbocharger cam-driven high-pressure gasoline direct injection fuel system dual camshaft continuously variable valve timing sodium-filled stainless steel Inconel exhaust valves low-friction cast aluminum pistons with oil squirters forged steel crankshaft forged steel connecting rods cast stainless steel exhaust manifold

[Dunk]

These big power projects are all very technically impressive but why? I have had all manor of different tuned/standard Lotus/VX and the best one of them all? 122BHP K series Elise. Or a standard 2.2 NA.    I just bought a Honda S2 (NA)  but I'm still not 100% sure I will part with my K series car for it. Had a Rotrex S2 Elise recently that was pretty good but too fast for road use with 285BHP. Power is good for the first handful of times you drive it but then you just get used to it but ultimately you are left with a potentially unreliable car that you just spunked 20 grand on....

You shoulda been hooning in the Highlands last weekend. High BHP was in no way a hindrance. Judging by the grins & the chat, NA drivers also had a great time, so I'm not claiming power and torque are the be all & end all of a fun driving experience. It certainly offers an additional dimension though, even on the road & I don't blame anyone for going down that route, nor do I think it spoils a car. A poorly executed mod can ruin it though, be that geo/ride-height/suspension, wheels, tyres or engine tuning. Peaky, laggy, high output, big turbos seem to give the high power installations a bad name. It's a nonsense. "Too fast for road use" suggests the cars are undrivable or you're on the wrong roads

[mbes2]

 

These big power projects are all very technically impressive but why? I have had all manor of different tuned/standard Lotus/VX and the best one of them all? 122BHP K series Elise. Or a standard 2.2 NA.    I just bought a Honda S2 (NA)  but I'm still not 100% sure I will part with my K series car for it. Had a Rotrex S2 Elise recently that was pretty good but too fast for road use with 285BHP. Power is good for the first handful of times you drive it but then you just get used to it but ultimately you are left with a potentially unreliable car that you just spunked 20 grand on....

You shoulda been hooning in the Highlands last weekend. High BHP was in no way a hindrance. Judging by the grins & the chat, NA drivers also had a great time, so I'm not claiming power and torque are the be all & end all of a fun driving experience. It certainly offers an additional dimension though, even on the road & I don't blame anyone for going down that route, nor do I think it spoils a car. A poorly executed mod can ruin it though, be that geo/ride-height/suspension, wheels, tyres or engine tuning. Peaky, laggy, high output, big turbos seem to give the high power installations a bad name. It's a nonsense. "Too fast for road use" suggests the cars are undrivable or you're on the wrong roads

 

 

Hoon in London... its too fast 

[Dunk]

 

These big power projects are all very technically impressive but why? I have had all manor of different tuned/standard Lotus/VX and the best one of them all? 122BHP K series Elise. Or a standard 2.2 NA.    I just bought a Honda S2 (NA)  but I'm still not 100% sure I will part with my K series car for it. Had a Rotrex S2 Elise recently that was pretty good but too fast for road use with 285BHP. Power is good for the first handful of times you drive it but then you just get used to it but ultimately you are left with a potentially unreliable car that you just spunked 20 grand on....

You shoulda been hooning in the Highlands last weekend. High BHP was in no way a hindrance. Judging by the grins & the chat, NA drivers also had a great time, so I'm not claiming power and torque are the be all & end all of a fun driving experience. It certainly offers an additional dimension though, even on the road & I don't blame anyone for going down that route, nor do I think it spoils a car. A poorly executed mod can ruin it though, be that geo/ride-height/suspension, wheels, tyres or engine tuning. Peaky, laggy, high output, big turbos seem to give the high power installations a bad name. It's a nonsense. "Too fast for road use" suggests the cars are undrivable or you're on the wrong roads  

  Hoon in London... its too fast 

Exactly! #wrongroads

[Exmantaa]

If you are seriously considering pumping a 5-figure sum into an engine, you should also consider the latest generation of Ecotec Turbo engines Gen II / III Ecotec), essentially the latest versions of the VX220's 2.2 Z22SE engine. http://en.wikipedia....M_Ecotec_engine   As used in the current Astra VXR, and the Insignia SRi (plus lots of US cars, hence many tuning parts) its an almost drop in because its the same basic engine as the 2.2, so engine mounts, gearbox, clutch, driveshafts, coolant pipes are all connect up.   You'd need all the stuff as a stage 4 turbo (chargecooler, exhaust, larger turbo, fuelling, engine management), but after that its just generally better in everyway compared to a generation older turbo engine, plus its lighter and more fuel efficient too.. The standard engine is good for ~400bhp according to many US users.   Unique LNF features[11] include: a twin-scroll turbocharger cam-driven high-pressure gasoline direct injection fuel system dual camshaft continuously variable valve timing sodium-filled stainless steel Inconel exhaust valves low-friction cast aluminum pistons with oil squirters forged steel crankshaft forged steel connecting rods cast stainless steel exhaust manifold

 

I's a very interesting option and also this GM engine is the base of the SwindonTOCA engines.

 

But:

- Stock turbo placement is difficult in a VX220 layout => sacrifice boot or custom manifold set-up.

- Newer ecu's are integrated in total car systems (GM-LAN), so you need to find a solution to work as stand-alone (few options for ther GM ecu) or try different ecu, but good luck finding one that supports dual var.cams and direct injection...

 

Edited by Exmantaa, 27 May 2015 - 12:39 PM.

[Rosssco]

 

If you are seriously considering pumping a 5-figure sum into an engine, you should also consider the latest generation of Ecotec Turbo engines Gen II / III Ecotec), essentially the latest versions of the VX220's 2.2 Z22SE engine. http://en.wikipedia....M_Ecotec_engine   As used in the current Astra VXR, and the Insignia SRi (plus lots of US cars, hence many tuning parts) its an almost drop in because its the same basic engine as the 2.2, so engine mounts, gearbox, clutch, driveshafts, coolant pipes are all connect up.   You'd need all the stuff as a stage 4 turbo (chargecooler, exhaust, larger turbo, fuelling, engine management), but after that its just generally better in everyway compared to a generation older turbo engine, plus its lighter and more fuel efficient too.. The standard engine is good for ~400bhp according to many US users.   Unique LNF features[11] include: a twin-scroll turbocharger cam-driven high-pressure gasoline direct injection fuel system dual camshaft continuously variable valve timing sodium-filled stainless steel Inconel exhaust valves low-friction cast aluminum pistons with oil squirters forged steel crankshaft forged steel connecting rods cast stainless steel exhaust manifold

 

I's a very interesting option and also this GM engine is the base of the SwindonTOCA engines.

 

But:

- Stock turbo placement is difficult in a VX220 layout => sacrifice boot or custom manifold set-up.

- Newer ecu's are integrated in total car systems (GM-LAN), so you need to find a solution to work as stand-alone (few options for ther GM ecu) or try different ecu, but good luck finding one that supports dual var.cams and direct injection...

 

 

 

According to my (basic) measurements, it would only need a boot wall 'bulge' along the size of what Vocky installed for his different NA manifold. The turbo compressor outlet should also fit ok as long as it goes into a 90 degree bend fairly quickly.

 

Best bet would be to import a complete ECU / Loom from the LNF engine (as you do with the LSJ set-up). Use the GM ECU converted to standalone, and HP Tuners for calibration? The whole lot shouldn't be that expensive even in comparison to the stage 4 Harrop / Turbo stuff...  

[Exmantaa]

One day, if I have really no more projects, I will dust off the new A20NHT (=LNF) engine in the garage and check turbo fitment in my car. Might even see if the ecu and wiring loom will talk with my HPTuners.

[NOSBandit]

I'm currently in the middle of doing a 600+ build, engine is done and tested. There is a slight bulge and I have lost part of the boot as far as I can tell at the moment as rear clam is not back on yet.

[mbes2]

I'm currently in the middle of doing a 600+ build, engine is done and tested. There is a slight bulge and I have lost part of the boot as far as I can tell at the moment as rear clam is not back on yet.

 

600!! Do tell more about that build ?

[Dunk]

I'm currently in the middle of doing a 600+ build, engine is done and tested. There is a slight bulge and I have lost part of the boot as far as I can tell at the moment as rear clam is not back on yet.

  600!! Do tell more about that build ?

OMG Mark! Back away from the keyboard.

[jonnyboy]

These big power projects are all very technically impressive but why? I have had all manor of different tuned/standard Lotus/VX and the best one of them all? 122BHP K series Elise. Or a standard 2.2 NA.    I just bought a Honda S2 (NA)  but I'm still not 100% sure I will part with my K series car for it. Had a Rotrex S2 Elise recently that was pretty good but too fast for road use with 285BHP. Power is good for the first handful of times you drive it but then you just get used to it but ultimately you are left with a potentially unreliable car that you just spunked 20 grand on....

You shoulda been hooning in the Highlands last weekend. High BHP was in no way a hindrance. Judging by the grins & the chat, NA drivers also had a great time, so I'm not claiming power and torque are the be all & end all of a fun driving experience. It certainly offers an additional dimension though, even on the road & I don't blame anyone for going down that route, nor do I think it spoils a car. A poorly executed mod can ruin it though, be that geo/ride-height/suspension, wheels, tyres or engine tuning. Peaky, laggy, high output, big turbos seem to give the high power installations a bad name. It's a nonsense. "Too fast for road use" suggests the cars are undrivable or you're on the wrong roads

I was Just picked up a completely standard 122bhp S2 Elise from Elgin and had one of the best drives of my life. Did almost the same journey the other week in a 189bhp 111R and it was pure tedium. That's down to the stupid second cam thing and additional weight. But driving a totally standard car just reminds you that the best thing about these cars is the handling. Working the short throw box on the Elise and with no big cabin noise just listening to the slight whir from the gears and the click of the gearchange it was magical. If I'd taken my Honda it wouldn't have been the same, suspensions too hard, can barely get out of 3rd gear. Not as much actual driving could have been done. I could have participated in the post drive pub ammo willy waving though which ultimately is what 50% of the attraction of tuning is

[Rosssco]

One day, if I have really no more projects, I will dust off the new A20NHT (=LNF) engine in the garage and check turbo fitment in my car. Might even see if the ecu and wiring loom will talk with my HPTuners.

 

Get on with it We need another good build thread ala your yellow LSJ one..

 

Another option is to stick that turbo set-up onto a B207 engine, OBD Tuners, decent exhaust, LSJ intake manifold with TB adaptor.. I bet that's a simple recipe (relatively) for +300bhp / 300lb/ft (prob more) option with excellent response / drivablity, with near OEM durability. The later DI / VVT engine would just be a nice to have..