766 replies to this topic

[paulf-cam]

Peak power gains for the stage 1 are about 25bhp. At peak gains we're seeing over 40bhp up

So thats 190bhp for the stage 3?

[Crispy]

Peak power gains for the stage 1 are about 25bhp. At peak gains we're seeing over 40bhp up

When you are driving it, it's like the power and the engine wont stop giving you more. It takes some getting used to!

If the weather is good I'll be along to the Chase on Sunday if anyone wants to have a look.

John -- will you be there?

[vocky]

so is that 25 - 40 bhp gains JUST from the throttle bodies or in a package [cams, head, etc]

[richyroff]

so is that 25 - 40 bhp gains JUST from the throttle bodies or in a package [cams, head, etc]

What he said...

Crispy If you can get along to the chase on sunday I'd be very interested in a nose round, and possibly a pax ride?

Rich

[Thorney]

We're racing at Oulton Park on the Sat but I missed the L2B so am intending (assuming I dont die of tiredness) to come along to the Chase (I must be mad). The power figures need to be explained as the way the throttle bodies deliver power is very different (eh Crispy) so whilst peak power is up about 25bhp the TB carries on rising when the standard car drops off so peak power at the TB peak is over 40bhp more (stage 1 car). When I post the charts up you'll see, TB conversions aren't about low range grunt but high end revvy power and it certainly doesn't disappoint in that regard. With a bit of luck I'll be at the Chase in the stage 3 car.

[siztenboots]

There is a trackday the following Monday nearby at Colerne unless you are in a hurry to get back to MK. Details 'ere

[SteveM]

Peak power gains for the stage 1 are about 25bhp. At peak gains we're seeing over 40bhp up

When you are driving it, it's like the power and the engine wont stop giving you more. It takes some getting used to!

If the weather is good I'll be along to the Chase on Sunday if anyone wants to have a look.

John -- will you be there?

I for one will be interested to have a nose around your car on Sunday, and get your thoughts after a few weeks of the TB experience. Is yours a stage 1, 2 or 3?

[Crispy]

Peak power gains for the stage 1 are about 25bhp. At peak gains we're seeing over 40bhp up

When you are driving it, it's like the power and the engine wont stop giving you more. It takes some getting used to!

If the weather is good I'll be along to the Chase on Sunday if anyone wants to have a look.

John -- will you be there?

I for one will be interested to have a nose around your car on Sunday, and get your thoughts after a few weeks of the TB experience. Is yours a stage 1, 2 or 3?

It's had a TMS stage 2 for a couple of years, and then the TB kit was added -- so not sure how that fares in the new world

The power figures need to be explained as the way the throttle bodies deliver power is very different (eh Crispy)

Yeah definitely!

so is that 25 - 40 bhp gains JUST from the throttle bodies or in a package [cams, head, etc]

What he said...

Crispy If you can get along to the chase on sunday I'd be very interested in a nose round, and possibly a pax ride?

Rich

Might have a friend with me, if not you're welcome to a PAX ride -- let hope its sunny, I dont fancy testing in the wet!

[Crispy]

In case anyone is interested, I told my insurance company about the TB conversion and they charged me £25 extra. I'm insured through Greenlight, i took the policy out on Jan 31st and it was around £850 -- so by my calculations thats an approx 4% increase.

[richyroff]

In case anyone is interested, I told my insurance company about the TB conversion and they charged me £25 extra.

I'm insured through Greenlight, i took the policy out on Jan 31st and it was around £850 -- so by my calculations thats an approx 4% increase.

That £25 is just their admin fee, add the TB conversion at renewal time and its free

I've had it noted with Greenlight for the last two renewals!

Edited by richyroff, 18 May 2007 - 07:45 AM.

[Flanners]

So what is going on with this? What are the bhp increases what are the prices?

[Thorney]

I'm coming in on Sat to type it all up and get it on the website, Webcon want to joint press release it so it needs a bit of co-ordination.

[Flanners]

I'm coming in on Sat to type it all up and get it on the website, Webcon want to joint press release it so it needs a bit of co-ordination.

TFFT! I look forward to the results may hold off on a tubby or an older VX + SC, to complement/replace my Stage3; a few days more. Be interested in the price forthe TBs to be added and a ECU/remap to my car.

Edited by Flanners, 24 May 2007 - 07:59 PM.

[DutchMike]

It's pretty quiet in this topic while there is a lot to talk about folks

http://www.thorneymo..._NA_Power.shtml

Thorney Motorsport VX220 NA Power Pack 4 - £2999
Thorney Motorsport Throttle Body Conversion +30bhp and 40llbs
Developed over two years in conjunction with Webcon this is the ultimate progression to enhance power from the 2.2 engine and still keep the perfect power delivery that only normally aspirated engines can give. Replacing the single throttle body assembly with separate throttle bodies is the time honoured way of increasing power without affecting natural normally aspirated power delivery. The car is literally transformed, low and mid range torque and power remain similar to the standard car but 4500rpm (where the standard car starts to tail off) the throttle bodies literally drive the power ever further; driving a throttle body car is a very different experience to a standard VX220.

Being blunt, if low down grunt and lazy power is your aim then look elsewhere, the throttle body conversion is about high revving stupidity, if you thrash your car then this conversion is aimed exactly at you. The electronic throttle is removed and replaced with a cable throttle and mirrors identically the throttle feel and travel of the Elise (it should do, we borrowed the design) so former Elise owners will be well versed in the feel. The cars ECU is retained (to run the rev counter) but otherwise is completely replaced by the Alpha N unit which comes complete with its own loom and is 'plug and play'.

Of course there is also the noise, nothing sounds like a throttle body car, at low rpm the car barks and rumbles like a pure race car and you'll find yourself blippig the throttle everywhere just to hear it. At high rpm the sound is simply intoxicating and you'll be holding higher gears just to hear it (let alone the linear power delivery). THe cars rev limit is programable but we raise it to 6800rpm (with a hard cut at 7000) so basically you can finally say you got the car off the clock as the VX220 rev counter only goes round to 7000 anyway!

Instalation typically takes 3 days but we like to have the car for a week to make sure, however the kit is also available as a self instalation with complete fitting instructions, a decent home mechanic could fit it in a a weekend.


Thorney Motorsport VX220 NA Power Pack 5 - £4999
Thorney Motorsport Throttle Body conversion, gas flowed head, Schrick racing cams

Simple really, throttle body conversions gain power at the upper revs so why not add a decent set of cams and gas flow/port the head to take advantage of this extra power.

The Schrick racing cams are well proven in the excellent power increase and driveability and whilst the 2.2 head is hardly poor a propoer gas flowing and decent porting will exploit every available hose power. The combination of these two attributes already grace our stage 3 conversion so add the throttle body kit makes a tremendous difference.

The Schrick cams are a complete top engine re-build with double valve springs, caps and collets so we're able to raise the rev limit further to 7400rpm and even then power is still climbing all the way over 8000 (where frankly we bottled it). Driving one of these conversions is like sailing, you don't get the harsh push that you get with forced induction as akin to a motorboat it's more a wave of effortless drive that feels endless and encourages you just to keep going and going.

Oh yes, they also sound stunning, think of the nicest sounding Caterham and you're about right - thats throttle bodies.


Thorney Motorsport VX220 NA Power Pack 6 - £TBC
Thorney Motorsport Throttle Body Conversion, gas flowed head, Schrick racing cams, high compression head, TMS equal length, 4 into 1 four branch manifold

Currently our ultimate level of tuning for the VX220 NA and still in testing. All we're doing now is strangthening the bottom end and we'll be going for 275-300bhp - whatever is possible.

The four branch manifold is a work of art and on its own generates 8-10bhp on even a bog standard car. Developed in conjunction with Primary Designs who are best known for their work on F1, F3000 and GP2 cars the design brief was simple. The 2.2 already had decent torque levels (it was designed with torque in mind) but to gain upper end power more akin to a sports car a 4 into 1 manifold is needed. The crucial concept is that each branch must be of identical length to maximise power and airflow which is no easy feat considering the lack of space to work in.

The design is perfect, it bolts straight onto a Milltek cat section without modification, requires no cutting to the clam in any way and has shown to be one of the best ways to gain power on any configuration of VX220 NA, in fact we're kicking ourselves we didn't do this earlier! On a standard NA it gain 12bhp, on a stage 2 it gained 10bhp on a stage 3 it gained 8bhp - this is one of the most consistent methods of gaining power we've ever seen.

The four branch manifold is available separately for £1175.


All prices include VAT



John, what will the price be of the power pack#4 kit parts (so without fitting)?
And are there any power curves available yet?
Thanks


And... what are the power/torque gains for power pack#5?

[ChazUwe]

Well spotted! Very interesting reading, I wonder if there are any dyno graphs available? Sounds very promising

[Winstar]

£3k for 30 bhp!!! £1175 for a 4-1 manifold!!! what's it made of INCONEL

Edited by Winstar, 25 May 2007 - 08:51 PM.

[Thorney]

Will put up charts and piccies tomorrow, too tired tonight. 30bhp on an NA car is actually pretty phenominal and the 4 branch manifold is something else to behold. No its not cheap but then Primary Designs aren't exaclty unknown at this, their manifolds for F1 cars are over £30k each!

[Winstar]

their manifolds for F1 cars are over £30k each!

but that's because they will be made of investment cast inconel, just producing the waxes for low volume designs cost thousands, we use the same process for our prototype turbine wheels.

Edited by Winstar, 25 May 2007 - 10:34 PM.

[dimd00d]

If those prices include fitting, then what is the price of the DIY kit?

[VIX]

Looking good. I'll be interested to see the charts and Crispy's report back. What state of tune is the demo car?