766 replies to this topic

[Crispy]

we put crispy's back to stock for power runs then fitted the tb kit to get a good comparison.

I wasn't aware of that so apologies for any confusion.

[Scotsdave]

You can't really be lazy with a throttle bodied engine. You'll find yourself changing down alot to get the best from the setup. But nothing can beat the noise and rush from reving the engine.

Presumably when you're driving "normally" there's no difference, you only have to keep the rev's up if you're maximising performance?

Spot on (apart from the noise)

What I'm wrong about the noise? I thought throttle bodies sound ace do you disagree

[Crispy]

No it sounds great, hence its a difference.

[LY_Scott]

No it sounds great, hence its a difference.

I think thats agreement.

[Scotsdave]

No it sounds great, hence its a difference.

so we're in agreement

[markv]

Yeah I guess I should separate out the non TB stages from the TB stages, its getting complicated as they can obviously mix and match which gets confusing. Think I'll do a separate page and have them come together as it were as they mix?

That's probably a good idea. I think it gets a bit confusing with the current page . And it doesn't really bring out the advantage of the throttlebodies. I guess the power pack 5 should be the main focus of entry into the TB range of tuning, with the power pack 4 being the "step in model" to be able to do easy upgrades. But powerpack 4 is not really where the TB's are going to be optimal...

As regards charts, yes they show a standard to stage 1, we put crispy's back to stock for power runs then fitted the tb kit to get a good comparison. Stage 2 to TB kit would be less pronounced on the chart but still feel the same in terms of delivery on the road.

Ok, that's promissing! With only the throttlebodies and the ECU on the car, those are pretty nice values. The standard downpipe/pre-cat/cat is a major problem for delivering power. So I would guess that TB's with a nice flowing exhaust should make for a fair amount of extra torque. I allready saw a very intersting difference when changing over the exhaust on my own car. You don't see often see a long term fuel change coming by of 17% Should be more pronounced with the optimal induction of the TB's.

Mark

[coopa]

Completely confused now. Can someone confirm the work on Crispy's car was: Crispy took a stage 2 in which was put back to standard then dyno'd The throttle body kit was added, remapped then dyno'd The aftermarket exhaust was put back on, remapped (dyno'd?) and given back to Crispy Seems an awful lot of effort for stage one charts but is that correct? If so, Crispy what was the final dyno figure for your car with the Milltek back on? Interested as that is the setup that I believe a lot of NA owners would go for

[speedster]

OK, some statistics. We've now dyno'd about 275 NA's and of those we've had 6 that gave 145bhp that were standard. Of the rest over 80% were 133-135bhp.

This is power measured at the wheels I assume.....?

[andyroo]

This is power measured at the wheels I assume.....?

I would imagine that was at the fly...

Maybe the power options would be better laid out as two sections, Power Pack 1-3 as normal and Throttle Bodies Power Park 1-3 as well, cos making throttle bodies power pack 4 implies you have to have power pack 3 to proceed to 4... If thats any help?

[Thorney]

Yeah, I'll re-write it. Coopa, we took Crispy's car, put it back to standard dyno'd it, added throttle bodies and his Milltek back on and dyno'd it again. We did develop the TB kit on a standard exhaust car and the cumulative gains were identical (its a slightly different map), remember the TB's simply gain power over what it is there. Seeing as most poeple have either a Miltlek or another exhaust this seemed the most sensible option.

[MartinS]

So, a car that has a full Miltek plus the tb's, produces what torque and power? Just trying to get a clear understanding. Thanks Martin s

[Thorney]

As per the page, that shows Cripsy's car with TB's and Milltek.

[Jim_Cross]

As per the page, that shows Cripsy's car with TB's and Milltek.

So in that case, 8-12bhp of the gain is from the Milltek, the rest is from the TBs?

[MartinS]

This topic is so long now, I dont even know where 'crispys page' is, without spending hours. Martin s Its no good, I just havent got the time to trawl through 32 pages. Whats the power/torque on a car with a full Miltek exhaust system? Martin s

[Thorney]

The TB kits add 25bhp to whatever tune there was there before, the Milltek adds power but its not quite as simple as 1 + 1 = 2, the gains are not incremental.

Martin, the chart is on the website here:



THis shows a standard car and a car with TB's and a Milltek on.

[Tolksee]

So £3k for TBs + £1k for a Milltek, £4000 for the above gains???

Edited by Tolksee, 05 June 2007 - 04:05 PM.

[Baron Von Scubadaddy]

So £3k for TBs + £1k for a Milltek, £4000 for the above gains???

super charger?

[markv]

If you want to go forced induction then a supercharger is a good option. If you want NA power delivery, then probably the next stage up will be more interesting, so car with different cam's. I think that should be really interesting with TB's Mark

[Crispy]

So £3k for TBs + £1k for a Milltek, £4000 for the above gains???

super charger?

You can't compare SC power gains / cost with TB power gains / cost -- both change the car in a completely different way.

[SteveM]

I have overlayed my TMS dyno results onto the TB chart for my stage 2+ (green dots). I'll let you draw your own conclusions......



I was surprised at how close/identical the figures were to the standard n/a up to 4krpm. Only then did mine stretch it's legs over the standard.

Edited by SteveM, 05 June 2007 - 06:22 PM.