57 replies to this topic

[goofballs]

good luck. cheers

[clipping_point]

Thi piccy uploading works. Here is my steering arm mod!

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[Ricky2772]

so, you machined away what, 2 mm? for avg track use, I find plenty to just remove all 5 shims at the front....at least the temperature readings I got after hot laps told me I was in the perfect range..... tyre temperature is always the perfect judge for correct camber and toe.

[clipping_point]

Yes, 2 mm, but just on the left side of the car since it was there I could not get the sufficient adjustment range.

[clipping_point]

BEFORE

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[clipping_point]

AFTER

[clipping_point]

AFTER

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[jaggeler]

for avg track use, I find plenty to just remove all 5 shims at the front....at least the temperature readings I got after hot laps told me I was in the perfect range.....
tyre temperature is always the perfect judge for correct camber and toe.

Hi Ricky

can you please tell me what's the result in degree?

Udo

[clipping_point]

Sorry, just as info: Lotus 340R Track Settings FRONT Castor +3.8°, ±0.2° (max side/side 0.2° ) Camber -1.8°, +0.1° -0.2° Toe 0.5mm Toe OUT overall, +0.2mm -0.0 REAR Camber -2.7°, ±0.2° (max side/side 0.2° ) Toe 2.5mm toe IN, +0.2mm -0mm (max side/side 0.2mm) These are roughly the figures I will use.

[Ricky2772]

allright, after the Quaife differential, I've been playing around with camber angles, and now I need to remove 1mm off the front... one side I had 2 shims left, so no prob, but on the right front I was already down to nothing, so here comes the need of machining... being a DIY guy, I tried to remove the support depicted in the clipping point picture... but... no way to remove the fecker, the steering arm (smaller bolt) would disconnect easily, but from the upper triangle I could not! I tried prying and hammering it, but did not want to force it too much, fearing of breaking the balljoint rubber casing... clipping point, can you give me a lead on how to detach it from the the upper arm? anyway, so far I worked around the problem working on the part still connected to the triangle... I used a set of sharp, flat files, the ones used for ski tuning... (pic below) it worked pretty well, only precaution is making sure that you are filing away the same thickness above and below each hole.... so a precision caliper is needed. at one point, Imeasured 2mm above the two holes, and 1,5mm below, meaning I was un-even with my hand pressure on the file... anyway, few careful passes aimed to the bottom surface fixed the problem. I guess IF I managed to remove the arm, I could've run it on top of the file, with better grip and leverages, but hey, we do what we can right?!? you have to measure the tickness with the allen bolt in the hole, so that the measuring caliper can rest squarely on its head above, and on the machined surface below. do NOT try to machine using a hand-held orbital/drill grinder, (like I did at first) since the surface will not be smooth and the contact area between arm and hub uneven, leading to stress issues.

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Edited by Ricky2772, 06 May 2005 - 08:30 AM.

[cicastol]

being a DIY guy, I tried to remove the support depicted in the clipping point picture...

but...

no way to remove the fecker, the steering arm (smaller bolt) would disconnect easily, but from the upper triangle I could not!
I tried prying and hammering it, but did not want to force it too much, fearing of breaking the balljoint rubber casing...

clipping point, can you give me a lead on how to detach it from the the upper arm?

Is fcuking hard to remove the ball joint,you must use an extractor and while thightening you must hammering the side of the steering arm.


"devi usare un'estrattore di quelli belli grossi,martella il lato dei braccetti con una mazzetta e vedrai che esce pero'ì sono veramente bastardi!!
Io ho fresato i braccetti da una parte di 2mm e dall'altra di 4mm visto che avevo una differenza.
Adesso sono a -1.4° con 2 shim e il portafilo abs "

[cicastol]

do NOT try to machine using a hand-held orbital/drill grinder, (like I did at first) since the surface will not be smooth and the contact area between arm and hub uneven, leading to stress issues.

ROTFL only you could try to grind the steering arm by hand..!!!

Sei il solito animale!!

[slimvince]

Hi CP, did not quite get it, but would the situation gotten worse or better with you sitting in the car? If it gets perfect with you on board, then you have it (as Ricky was suggesting)! Unless of course you want to optimise it all for an empty car (or with a passenger) . ...for a moment I thought there was a request for a piccy of 80 kg+ blonde viking VERY interesting anyway Edit: I just re-read more carefully, and noticed that the driver's weight would have made an improvement - just wondering how much with your spring/damper setup?

Edited by slimvince, 06 May 2005 - 10:03 AM.

[clipping_point]

The steering arm is bolted to the hub and the ball joint I removed with my BILTEMA thingy



I think the lowering affected the camber with 0,5-1,0° (Eibach springs). I havent checked the new setting withém Nitrons

[Ricky2772]

Sei il solito animale!!

...now with 1mm less camber at the front , and rears with a bit more toe-in (1/4 turn) is much more stable at speed, not following every ondulation anymore....I also lowered tyre pressure to 1,6 front and 1,7r....and dialed off most clicks at front shocks, following a tuner advice that tested my speedy after the quaife installation...he felt it was too rigid at the front, hence the need to drop pressure, camber and clicks... it worked a treat indeed...

Cica, I will be glad to compare/swap our cars at the Mas du Clos (France) trackday may 23...

Edited by Ricky2772, 06 May 2005 - 11:44 AM.

[cicastol]

Cica, I will be glad to compare/swap our cars at the Mas du Clos (France) trackday may 23...

I'll need another 80hp to compare our car and some less Kg ..!!!

[Ricky2772]

does anybody know FOR SURE if adding 1mm to the camber will (substantially ) change the toe value? asking this since I run a geo tonight, (I had the whole rear frame removed to install the quaife...), and I found : rear left: -3° camber and 3,8mm toe in, rear right -2.2° camber and 2,2mm toe in (front -1,5° both and -0,9mm outeach) I guess while reinstalling frame+ suspension arms, the tuner moved things around a bit.... I now experimented adding a 1mm shim on the left, to reduce the excessive -3° drove around at it felt pretty good, but I was wondering if it took care of the excessive toe in as well... will run another rear geo-check soon, but I like to play around and "foresee" the results....

[Ricky2772]

rear left: -3° camber and 3,8mm toe in,
rear right -2.2° camber and 2,2mm toe in

(front -1,5° both and -0,9mm outeach)

I added 1mm to the rear left, that went from -3.0° to -2,3°
so I now have both rears at -2.3° camber and 2.5mm toe in each

both front has -1,3° and 0.4mm out, (0.9 total)

feels pretty good now, I might try to reduce a smidge toe out at front, maybe dropping to 0.5mm total... also increasing front 048 pressure a bit, to 1,7-1,8...