27 replies to this topic

[cyberface]

Finally after bombing around the country doing 3-400 mile trips at quick motorway speeds, my numberplate has given up fighting the windblast and fallen off. Double luckily, the previous owner of my car obviously knew about this and there's a spare front numberplate in the boot, and also it fell off when stationary so I didn't lose it on the road. Two things - I've bought some thick foamy double sided adhesive to fix it back on with, but couldn't be arsed to scrape off all the old glue / use solvents / clean both surfaces perfectly / etc. in the dark, so just stuck the plate in the windscreen ready to do the job tomorrow. Is this illegal? The numberplate is visible to the carpark nazis, and will be visible to cars coming the other way if I drive it, but will most certainly not be visible to speed cameras Should I not drive it until I get the numberplate fixed on again, and if the carpark nazis give me a ticket for 'not displaying a numberplate' then surely I've got a leg to stand on to fight the fine?

[NickH]

I'd ditch the double sided foam tape, it's rubbish. Pop to your local B&Q or similar and get some heavy duty velcro but you'll still need to clean all the other stuff off first. I would have thought the numberplate would be fine in the window until you sort it out properly, you can say it just fell off if you get stopped!

[l14mha]

since mine got stolen, stolen and stolen again...... (little buggers)

i have not replaced it. i drive without.

since then i have done over 4000 miles with no problems, no fines ..... touch wood.

i don't drive recklessly but it kinda comes in handy down the M4 doing 80 to 85 MPH with eyes on the bridge taking little pics...

what would happen if they stop you, a friend of mine got stopped in the summer and only got a £30 fine and a producer.... if this is the norm , who needs a laser diffuser....

(not that i would do this as it's illegal)

[Pulsatingstar]

Ive not had a front plate on the rx7 for 2 years and havnt been stopped yet. Its £30 non endorsable if you are stopped though, I was waiting for the first time it happened and it hasnt.

[Spindoctor]

I'd ditch the double sided foam tape, it's rubbish.

Pop to your local B&Q or similar and get some heavy duty velcro but you'll still need to clean all the other stuff off first.

I would have thought the numberplate would be fine in the window until you sort it out properly, you can say it just fell off if you get stopped!

That B&Q velcro is solid as a rock. And it didn't take me long to remove the remnants of the old sticky pads - tiny helping of white spirit and elbow grease and 15 minutes.

[Muncher]

Certain people haven't had one on their VX for two years now...

[cyberface]

Seriously - at £30 non endorsable I'd be tempted to leave the bugger off and forget about those damn average-speed cameras that are popping up everywhere.... Alternatively if I'm feeling law-abiding, presumably the velcro requires both surfaces to be clean and all old sticky crap removed... and then the numberplate is removable whenever I fancy, like normal velcro? I can see both benefits and problems with this... firstly if I leave the numberplate affixed (with velcro) then it can be easily stolen if left on the car. Secondly I can remove it when doing long journeys with average-speed cameras..... If stopped, is it an immediate fine or at the officer's discretion? And if I have a plate in the car that I can slap on as soon as the cops stop me, will that stop them from issuing a fine? Maybe the velcro would make the cop smell a rat (if it's that easy to use then it should be on the car in the first place, presumably....)

[Spindoctor]

Alternatively if I'm feeling law-abiding, presumably the velcro requires both surfaces to be clean and all old sticky crap removed... and then the numberplate is removable whenever I fancy, like normal velcro?

I can see both benefits and problems with this... firstly if I leave the numberplate affixed (with velcro) then it can be easily stolen if left on the car. Secondly I can remove it when doing long journeys with average-speed cameras.....

I wouldn't say the plate just lifts off that velcro - its pretty industrial strength, you could probably snap or permanently bend the plate if you're not careful.

Go for a 3/4 sized plate - they look far better and they must be slightly more efficient. You can still get nicked though with the 3/4, not that I have, yet. Keep the original plates with you and plead ignorance or say you've just left/on way to a track day - may not work, but worth a go.

Edited by Spindoctor, 29 January 2007 - 10:13 PM.

[medlow]

If stopped, is it an immediate fine or at the officer's discretion? And if I have a plate in the car that I can slap on as soon as the cops stop me, will that stop them from issuing a fine? Maybe the velcro would make the cop smell a rat (if it's that easy to use then it should be on the car in the first place, presumably....)

Having no front plate (but one in the boot just incase) spells out to the copper that "I know I am doing wrong but I thought I would get away with it"

"Where is your front plate sir?"
"Ive got one in the boot"
"Well why is it not on the car sir?"
"Errrm??"

It may just get mr policman more annoyed and issue you a fine anyways.

You could use the excuse that you have removed it for a trackday and just forgot to put it back on tho..!

Ive got a 3/4 front plate, it looks great and i have yet to be stopped.. I will one day though I bet..

MED..

Edited by medlow, 29 January 2007 - 10:15 PM.

[cyberface]

Yeah that's what I was getting at - being rumbled as a 'smartarse'. However if the velcro is semi-removable (i.e. not permanent damage, perhaps I could go for the next grade of strength down...) then the 'trackday' argument could be perfectly valid as long as the copper hasn't seen you 10 times over the last 2 weeks and finally decided to take action... After all, removable velcro would be perfect for trackdays - take off for better radiator cooling, back on for the drive home (or not because I forgot... ) Then again, if it's non-endorsable and maximum fine is £30 then I'd be happy to risk it for a while until the local cops (if there are any, of course ) keep an eye out for my car. Anyone know if subsequent offences get larger penalties? In other words, I get stopped for no front numberplate (velcro) and pay a £30 non-endorsable fine, and 2 weeks later get stopped again. Is there any escalating penalty, or can the cop say I'm taking the p*ss and send me to court? Just for info of course, if there are any serving officers here then I'm just interested in legal stuff

[Timbo]

If you do get stopped and you havent got one, just tell the copper, "well officer i checked it was there this morning whilst i was checking all my lights were working, so it must have fallen off" . What can they say!!!!

[Digital]

The heavy duty Velcro is much stronger than normal tape, but you can still peel the number plate off if you ease it from one side, I do this with mine since it fell off at a trackday. Easy to adjust if you stick it on squint the first time too

[sworks]

Maybe keep a 'broken' plate in the boot and tell them the number plate caught a speed bump and got ripped off. Thought this was the reason velcro is used instead of screws, to avoid the screws ripping through the nuber plate plinth. Not that i would do this!

Edited by sworks, 29 January 2007 - 11:18 PM.

[Baron Von Scubadaddy]

Maybe keep a 'broken' plate in the boot and tell them the number plate caught a speed bump and got ripped off. Thought this was the reason velcro is used instead of screws, to avoid the screws ripping through the nuber plate plinth.

Not that i would do this!

I think you got it .
That the solution keep a broken one in the boot.
What a bout one of those adhesive plates they use on caravans ?

[stormtrooper]

I've been driving round with no number plate and had no problems even after passing several police cars this week. But i do keep a legal size plate in the boot which is in three pieces just in case i do get stop.

[smithers]

I've driven past hundreds of police with no front plate - I pass twickenham rugby ground all the time, and they are generally more interested in the car rather than no front plate - even when stopped at traffic lights/jams. This may be more to do with them policing the event etc, but even when passing cop cars on the open road or the local nick I've never had a problem. I have got a 3/4 plate on now with velcro, but I'll be damned if I can get it off again - think I used too much!! (has a rating of 28kg with the amount I used...) IIRC the smaller plate is a greater offence than no plate. Go figure

[jazzyjeff]

Is this illegal? The numberplate is visible to the carpark nazis, and will be visible to cars coming the other way if I drive it, but will most certainly not be visible to speed cameras

Should I not drive it until I get the numberplate fixed on again, and if the carpark nazis give me a ticket for 'not displaying a numberplate' then surely I've got a leg to stand on to fight the fine?

As you probably know its all covered by the Vehicle Excise and Registration Act 1994 s42 and s43.

s42 covers offences relating to fixing of the plate and s43 to the plate being obscured or 'not easily distinguishable'.

Offences under either of the above are liable to a fine, and the onus of proof is on the defendant (i.e. the driver) that they haven't committed an offence. I would imagine sticking your plate inside the car on the dashboard/inside the boot as falling under s43 (less easy to argue away obviously if its in the boot!!!)

Therefore, if the relevant "car park nazi" works for the local authority then you may be able to blind them with rhetoric. If however, the alleged offence was in a place overseen by the local constabulary then you can probably place the words creek, paddle and sh*t into a suitably arranged sentence...!

JJ

[cyberface]

Putting my 'fight the law' rhetoric to one side for a minute, and get back to simple law-abiding stuff. If my numberplate falls off, and I have no way of re-fixing to the assigned location at the front of the clam, then my options are either to run with no numberplate (i.e. stick it in the boot or passenger footwell) or put it at the front of the windscreen facing outwards, so someone looking at the car CAN SEE the plate. Would I be acting illegally (i.e. a copper even practising discretion would have to prosecute) by showing the plate through the windscreen? I often see lorries doing this, with the plate fully visible through the windscreen (often when towing etc.) - your comment mixing 'in windscreen / in boot' seems ODD to me, since if the plate is in the boot then it's most definitely obscured, whereas if it's in the windscreen then it's visible, surely? Obviously, with a plate in the windscreen, cameras will be foxed in most cases - but not as properly as if you run with no numberplate. If it's just as illegal to 'try to act in the spirit of the law' and show the numberplate whichever way I can, then I may as well run with no numberplate. Of course, my line of questioning was originally focused on screwing the total-surveillance camera system that I personally disagree with on a political / moral basis. However it's also of interest to everyone else whether you can legally temporarily run with a visible (through windscreen), but not in 'proper' location, numberplate - a lot of low-slung sports cars run the risk of broken front plates.

[theotherjonnymac]

I drove around for a year with small plates but got stopped a month or so ago. Have now reluctantly changed them. Apparently they can reclassify your car as a Q plate for non conformance but this might be the copper trying to scare me.

[Richy]

If you do get stopped and you havent got one, just tell the copper, "well officer i checked it was there this morning whilst i was checking all my lights were working, so it must have fallen off" .

What can they say!!!!

Ding

They frown more about small plates rather than not having one at all