4722 replies to this topic

[Darcini]

That seems a reasonable solution, frustrating though it must be you are going to get there in the end Nipper is going to be mind blowing on the road I'm sure

[techieboy]

Glad you've got a workable solution though.

[P11 COV]

So are you getting Courtenays to do the clutch?

[Nev]

Yup. I could 'easily' do it myself in a couple of evenings, but the hassle and time of travelling back and forth from Bristol to Norfolk etc just doesnt make it worth it. Better to get them to do it in practice, especially as it's my least favourite job. It seems a shame to not be able to release a bit more torque from the engine however, but I suppose keeping it down will help extend the life of the gearbox and make the car more drivable, abeit less mind-boggling than it could be. I am guessing but I think for the final map, boost will likely settle at around 1.4 bar (which is extremely low), for around 410 ft/lb at 4800 revs which should realise around 500 BHP at 7500 revs (or 515 at around 8000 revs). Ideally, I dont intend to rev it over 7000 too much as this knackers the engine about 4 times faster than needed. I'll keep the last 1000 revs for showing 'street exotica' that Vauxhall is boss I am already thinking about stage 2 of the project as I have so much time on my hands! I am working out ingenious ways of shifting weight forward and making a homemade splitter.

Edited by Nev, 23 June 2011 - 07:22 PM.

[siztenboots]

There are plenty of manufacturers who can supply a clutch which is able to take the torque from yhis engine and alot more, apart from the purchase cost which would need a new flywheel, one of their biggest problems is the are not nice to use in a road car.
I am talking about a 7 1/4 (184mm) twin plate clutch.
You would probably need to get one made to suit the crank bolt pattern, which would not be difficult and made correctly from the right material will not give any trouble (If the Germans have had trouble with their steel flywheels then they have been made wrong)

Steve

this is a supalite 7 1/4 flywheel I had made for me by TTV . Getting a decent streetable clutch was much harder and in the end I changed my mind and went back to a group N spec.

[steveboyslim]

There are plenty of manufacturers who can supply a clutch which is able to take the torque from yhis engine and alot more, apart from the purchase cost which would need a new flywheel, one of their biggest problems is the are not nice to use in a road car.
I am talking about a 7 1/4 (184mm) twin plate clutch.
You would probably need to get one made to suit the crank bolt pattern, which would not be difficult and made correctly from the right material will not give any trouble (If the Germans have had trouble with their steel flywheels then they have been made wrong)

Steve

this is a supalite 7 1/4 flywheel I had made for me by TTV . Getting a decent streetable clutch was much harder and in the end I changed my mind and went back to a group N spec.

I agree, I suggested to Nev that if he went with a twin plate clutch to go for the heavier flywheel from TTV and possibly down a size in clutch master cylinder.

steve

Edited by steveboyslim, 24 June 2011 - 09:47 AM.

[Nev]

I rang up Jon yesterday to see what was happening as it was now 3 weeks since I got them to order the hardened Sachs race clutch cover from Stephan. Apparently they had had a 'supply issue' (not that they bothered to ring me and tell me) and the part still hasn't arrived from Germany. The part is supposed to arrive by the end of this week, will require fitting which is almost a days work and then of course the final mapping will need to be done if they have spare time on the rollers. I guess I won't be picking it up for at least another 2 weeks. So frutrating to have this sort of delay at the last hurdle, as I am chomping at the bit to drive it.

[cheeky_chops]

10 days gone by - any news Nev??

[Nev]

I rang up Klassen a couple of days ago. Apparently the part may be in the UK by the end of next week (ie. 30/07/2011). He sounded very wooly about it, so I have little faith in it arriving to be honest. It's been a bloody irritating and shameful experience, for which I have to pay a lot of money. If I had known it would take this long I would have bought my own twin plate clutch system + flywheel and installed it myself and re-delivered the car to CS in far less time. In my work/industry, if you say something will take 2 weeks and it then take 6 weeks you get a huge bollocking and maybe put your job on the line if you keep doing it. In the motor industry if's just considered normal prcatice and nobody even appologises or give you a courtesy call to tell you whats happening. Grrr.

Edited by Nev, 23 July 2011 - 05:30 AM.

[Vespa]

I rang up Klassen a couple of days ago. Apparently the part may be in the UK by the end of next week (ie. 30/07/2011). He sounded very wooly about it, so I have little faith in it arriving to be honest.

It's been a bloody irritating and shameful experience, for which I have to pay a lot of money. If I had known it would take this long I would have bought my own twin plate clutch system + flywheel and installed it myself and re-delivered the car to CS in far less time.

In my work/industry, if you say something will take 2 weeks and it then take 6 weeks you get a huge bollocking and maybe put your job on the line if you keep doing it. In the motor industry if's just considered normal prcatice and nobody even appologises or give you a courtesy call to tell you whats happening.

Grrr.

This really sucks mate it's a real shame the motor industry works like this and sadly my experiences are usually the same. That said you can be grateful you're in the UK, you should try being out here - it's no coincidence the 'mediterranean' countries are in so much trouble, nobody wants to get out of bed for anything

Hope the wait with be worth it old pal!

[Arno]

I rang up Klassen a couple of days ago. Apparently the part may be in the UK by the end of next week (ie. 30/07/2011). He sounded very wooly about it, so I have little faith in it arriving to be honest.

Keep calling/bugging 'em..

It's very 'un-german', but Klassen and some of the other german Speedster tuners seem to do a lot of technically great work, but are terrible when it comes to keeping schedules and appointments.

Unless you keep on their tail it would not surprise me if it would take months for the part to arrive, if ever...

Like I said.. It's very 'un-german' as I've had dealings with several german firms and also in the car industry and they usually tend to be extremely punctual and concise (OK.. the swiss take that to the extreme, but still.. ), but not these

Bye, Arno.

[steveboyslim]

Nev, Did the clutch arrive ? Steve

[slindborg]

I rang up Klassen a couple of days ago. Apparently the part may be in the UK by the end of next week (ie. 30/07/2011). He sounded very wooly about it, so I have little faith in it arriving to be honest.

Keep calling/bugging 'em..

It's very 'un-german', but Klassen and some of the other german Speedster tuners seem to do a lot of technically great work, but are terrible when it comes to keeping schedules and appointments.

Unless you keep on their tail it would not surprise me if it would take months for the part to arrive, if ever...

Like I said.. It's very 'un-german' as I've had dealings with several german firms and also in the car industry and they usually tend to be extremely punctual and concise (OK.. the swiss take that to the extreme, but still.. ), but not these

Bye, Arno.

The automotive industry is usually good, the aftermarket tuning industry are frankly terrible and I'm not surprised in the slightest about the delays regardless of the country the tuner resides in.

[Nev]

Well, I've just rung Courtenay's up and the clutch cover has arrived and been fitted at long last Now I have to wait anything between 1 and 3 weeks for a spare slot on their dyno for it to have it's map finished I asked Mark Watts some specific questions about the new map's safety features. Some of you may be interested to hear that OEM and Klassen/Courtenay remaps have the following software features: 1: Detection of unexpectedly high MAP (manifold absolute pressure). If this occurs due to a 'run away' turbo spool, stuck closed wastegate or a vaccuum pipe disconection, the ECU will retard the ignition and/or open the wastegate. 2: Detection of unexpectedly high ACTs (Air Charge Temps). Apparently my map (and probably yours too) start to throw extra fuel in for cooling from 50 degrees C. 3: Knock sensor will obviously work as normal and retard the ignition when pre-ignition is detected. I have also asked them to give me a print out of duty cycle of the injectors of max RPM as it seems incredible to me that 630cc injectors can squirt for circa 500 BHP at under 80% duty cycle. Golly, I am getting exceited again. Nipper might be back in my hands soon and more or less fully working!

Edited by Nev, 01 August 2011 - 02:04 PM.

[ChrisS1]

I only understand a few sentences in the above post but it sounds very impressive! Fingers crossed it's ready for you to pick up soon

[Nev]

God, I'm so excited again I can barely contain it and can't concentrate on anything !

[cnrandall]

Well, I've just rung Courtenay's up and the clutch cover has arrived and been fitted at long last
Now I have to wait anything between 1 and 3 weeks for a spare slot on their dyno for it to have it's map finished

I asked Mark Watts some specific questions about the new map's safety features. Some of you may be interested to hear that OEM and Klassen/Courtenay remaps have the following software features:

1: Detection of unexpectedly high MAP (manifold absolute pressure). If this occurs due to a 'run away' turbo spool, stuck closed wastegate or a vaccuum pipe disconection, the ECU will retard the ignition and/or open the wastegate.
2: Detection of unexpectedly high ACTs (Air Charge Temps). Apparently my map (and probably yours too) start to throw extra fuel in for cooling from 50 degrees C.
3: Knock sensor will obviously work as normal and retard the ignition when pre-ignition is detected.

I have also asked them to give me a print out of duty cycle of the injectors of max RPM as it seems incredible to me that 630cc injectors can squirt for circa 500 BHP at under 80% duty cycle.

Golly, I am getting exceited again. Nipper might be back in my hands soon and more or less fully working!

If you can get the wastegate open when the MAP sensor reads high it would be best... Retarding ignition will increase EGT's, although its better than nothing. Correction against air charge temp is massively necessary on a FI engine. I LOVE knock control, its awesome, we log my engine and you can see the ECU pulling/adding small amounts of ignition on single cylinders in response to knock events :-)

I'm running 630's @ 3 BAR and have very little head room left. I remember you saying you are at 4 BAR so you should be OK.

Looking forward to seeing the results :-)

[Nev]

Well, I was running approx 4 bar on the fuel rail for running in purposes, but I asked Courtenays to put my old 3.3 Bar FPR back on for the remap. Maybe they have or maybe they have had to put a higher pressure FPR on, as I honestly can't understand how those 630cc injectors can supply enough fuel otherwise.At least my Bosch high power fuel pump can supply anything upto 7 bar safely, so they could even increase the FPR to a bit over 5.0 bar and still have headroom with 1.7 of boost pressure increasing the pressure on the rail upto around 6.7 Bar.

Edited by Nev, 02 August 2011 - 01:25 PM.

[Duncan VXR]

Great news Nev Suspect it will be when Jon gets back off his holiday before back on the rollers DG

[Nev]

Ah, whens that Duncan ? I did try getting a date out of Mark Watts, but he was being cagey about commiting to any dates it might be completed by.

Edited by Nev, 03 August 2011 - 11:23 AM.